Fattie Vegan FAQs

I love checking the search engine terms people who have stumbled on my blog used. Some of my favorites include:

“Why is fatties so mean”

“What the fuck is up with protein water”

“Diet rules for smaller lips” - just because HUH? WHA? ???

“Lesbian phone sex with your mom”

There are also some that I’m happy to get. Ones like ‘what to do about under belly itchy rash’ (hydrocortisone worked for me.) Or ‘being healthy without dieting.’ I hope some of what I write can be helpful to people.

But I also get a lot of questions that I would call veganism or fat acceptance 101. These are questions about a lot of the basic philosophy of each movement. “Are people really fatter today.” or “Why don’t vegans eat clams?” I get a lot of questions like these so I thought I’d create a place for people to ask them.

So go ahead. Are you curious as to why vegans don’t drink milk? Or whether or not vegans care about animals killed during plant harvesting? Do you have a question about fat acceptance that you’ve been afraid to ask?

All comment moderation is off for this thread. So feel free to be anonymous. Any obvious trolls and/or spammers will eventually be deleted.

Once I get a few questions I will create separate FAQ posts to answer them which I’ll link to in my sidebar.

Of course, it should go without saying that I do not represent veganism or the fat acceptance movement. If you read a question that you’d like to answer, feel free.

Now, don’t be shy. I know there are people out there with these questions so ask them.

Protein water: everything that’s wrong with us.

The commercial opens with this light, somewhat christmas-y music. A mound of brightly colored hard candies glisten in a store window while a worker pours another scoop on the pile. A woman stands in front of this display, eyes alight with anticipation. But don’t worry! the voice over assures us. She will not give in. She pulls a bottle of K20 protein water out of her bag. Crisis averted!

Huh?

First let’s talk a little bit about the ad. The actress in the commercial is Marisa Ramirez. Here’s a picture:

You know, I don’t think anyone needs to avoid candy if they want some, but are we really supposed to think that one sip of whey water is what stands between this woman and total loss of control and eventual candy binge? If not for the bottle in her purse, would she break through the window and start inhaling candy, wrapper and all?

Or are we going with the assumption that a few pieces of candy are enough to turn this slim woman into a headless fatty?

And hard candy? This is the big bogeyman which will destroy your self control?

Let’s do a little number crunching, shall we. A bottle of K20 has 50 calories and 8g of sugar (and only 5g of protein!.) A single butterscotch has about 23 calories and 3g of sugar. And neither of them have any fat to speak of, so which nutritional bugaboo are we exploiting here? I mean, kellogg sells a ton of those obnoxious 100 calorie snack packs. Should you drink the whey water instead of eating those? Somehow I doubt it.

Really I just can’t get over the fact that we live in a society where protein water is a viable product because people are so afraid of actual food. Where ads featuring thin women who are afraid of hard candies actually make sense to a lot of people.

Helping the pigs

I got an email today from farm sanctuary about pigs stranded in the floodwaters in the midwest.

Flood waters have ravaged the Midwest, and farm animals need immediate rescue! The recent flooding has hit largely agricultural areas, leaving pigs, cattle and other animals stranded.

Hundreds of factory farm pigs have been left trapped and drowning in crates, or freed only to be swept away by rapid currents … trying desperately to survive on area levees.

Farm Sanctuary dispatched a rescue team with our large animal rescue trailer last week and we are currently on the ground in Iowa and Illinois to save drowning and stranded pigs.

Please, give to the Emergency Rescue Fund right now to help our lifesaving efforts and rescue these stranded, suffering animals.

Since farm animals are not generally considered part of the family in the same way dogs and cats are, they’re left where they are when natural disasters strike. I’m not saying this to judge only to point out that there’s a big need for the resources to help these animals.

I know that many people have given money to the red cross and other organizations, but if you have a little more to spare, please consider giving a bit to help rescue as many of these animals as possible.

You can donate here.

Full email here.

Voluptuous Vixen

I have a complicated relationship with clothing. Fat since childhood, I was always left scouring the fugly jungle that was ‘husky’ clothing for a few acceptable garments that wouldn’t have me becoming the target of even more harassment at school. Perhaps it was a defense mechanism but by adolescence I was quite cynical (as well as much cooler and smarter than EVERYONE) and prided myself on not being one of those girls who spent hours coordinating outfits or carefully applying mascera. I didn’t care what I wore and it had absolutely nothing to do with an inability to find anything remotely stylish. Not at all.

As an adult, I both have a greater appreciation for those who can put together a stylish outfit and a feminist’s wariness of how much women are expected to care about these things.

For the most part, my relationship to fashion has been mostly theoretical. Having at most two stores at any one time where I could shop meant my wardrobe was full of clothes that were good enough, with maybe a few pieces that I just loved, but not a huge selection to choose from.

Anyway, this whole lead up is to say that I’ve never had that boutique shopping experience until this past week. I was in New Orleans visiting family and wouldn’t have noticed the store if not for my FSIL (future-sister-in-law). We had gone to an early mass at the St Louis cathedral (no, I’m not Catholic anymore, but still love a nice mass in a pretty church) and were looking for a nice breakfast place in the french quarter when she dragged me across the street to look in a store window. My FSIL is someone who really loves clothes. She isn’t snobby nor is she someone who sacrifices comfort for looks (although she is someone who will sacrifice 90 minutes of sleep to make sure her hair and makeup is perfect) and she doesn’t believe in dressing just to hide ‘flaws’. Her attitude is a bit contagious and she was just so damn excited to find a plus size boutique for me that I found myself completely excited and wishing the store would open early.

I didn’t actually get to the store until later in the evening. It’s an adorable place, not so different from a lot of clothing boutiques in the french quarter, but it seemed a bit livelier. Maybe that’s just because fat women, ime, tend to get celebratory when we get the opportunity to get together and look at clothes meant for us.

Honestly, I was a bit overwhelmed by the clothing. I’m so used to a lane bryant shopping experience where, in a large store, I might only see a half dozen pieces that I think are cute. In a store a quarter the size of my local lane bryant, I was seeing dozens of things that I wanted to try on.

The owner, Jaclyn, is exactly the type of person I want in a clothing store. She’s exuberant, and knowledgable, but she also only gives you as much help as you want. No following you around or asking every 2 seconds if you need something. She was also wearing a dress which I might never have looked at twice, but she was rocking it. (this one if anyone is interested.)

I had what can only be described as a completely giddy shopping experience. I tried on lots of dresses ( including this ‘princess’ dress by Anna Scholz - totally lovely, but I knew I wouldn’t wear it anywhere) and a few tops. Jaclyn helped me pair a cute sash with one of the dresses and encouraged me to try a swimsuit I’d been eyeing, but unsure of.

THIS SWIMSUIT IS THE MOST AWESOMEST THING EVER. Here’s a pic - even in the same color as mine. The kids I watch are tired of being dragged to the pool, but I must wear the suit at every opportunity.

I ended up with two dresses, the swimsuit, a sash and she threw in a matching headband. And I’ve worn everything several times. I haven’t been able to find any pictures of the dresses so eventually I’ll put ‘em on and post some pics. The whole experience was great and if you are in New Orleans, you must go there.

A note on cost: No, boutique shopping is not cheap. I couldn’t afford all the things I wanted to get there. According to the owner, the store has gotten some criticism for being too costly. I think at least part of it is that most fat women I know are in a state of constant denial about their fat. Expecting to lose weight ANY DAY NOW, the idea of plunking down $74 on a dress (the cost of one of my purchases there) is as good as admitting that you’ll probably still be a size twenty next year. Jaclyn thinks a big part is that fat women are so used to shopping big chain stores with their cheaply made clothing that they don’t know what real fabrics and workmanship cost.

And hey, I’m not discounting the fact that these clothes are out of the financial reach of many people. Not at all. But if cost is keeping you away from places like this, keep in mind that if you think of it as buying a few really nice pieces that are comfortable, will last a long time and can be mixed and matched, then you will probably spend the same amount on clothing at the voluptuous vixen that you would having to replace or continually find ok clothing at cheaper stores. Also there was a clearance rack with some awsome clothing that was as inexpensive as anything at a Lane Bryant or Fashion Bug.

The Voluptuous Vixen’s website.

The cult of dieting

I’m completely fascinated by cults. I read books, I search the internet for info. ‘Cult’ is a keyword search on my tivo. I’ve never lost a loved one to a cult or been in one myself, but the psychology of it baffles/interests me. From the outside, it can all look so obvious - the intense focus on the group, the demonization of outside forces, isolating people to make it harder to break away - but I don’t think for one second think that means that people who get involved in these groups are dumb or weak. In fact, one of the most fascinating aspects of cults to me is the way they overlap with more mainstream groups. The line between cult and not-cult isn’t always clear and studying cults is definitely a good way to see how vulnerable we all are to the techniques that lead some people into these groups.

For the most part, I’ve only thought about it in terms of religion. But I was on the phone a few days ago with my Aunt who was discussing her latest foray into weight watchers (It’s a lifestyle!) I was, naturally, completely uninterested and was using this time to read about different experts opinions on what characteristics make a cult. And since the title of this post is hardly subtle, you can probably guess what I’m thinking. So how is the culture of dieting a bit like a cult? Let’s see

Recruitment. The source I looked at gave 6 characteristics of cult recruiting. I think five of these six describe some of my experiences in WW, Jenny Craig, Nutrisystem etc…

2. Emotional Leverage/Love Bombing - Instant friendship, extreme helpfulness, generosity and acceptance…Group recruiters “lovingly” will not take “no” for an answer-invitations impossible to refuse without feeling guilty and/or ungrateful. “Love”, “generosity”, “encouragement” are used to lower defenses and create an ever increasing sense of obligation, debt and guilt.This is definitely my experience in WW. I was even paired with a diet buddy whom I was supposed to exchange phone numbers and be instantly friendly with.

3. Exploit Personal Crisis - They use an existing crisis as a means of getting you to participate. They exploit vulnerability arising from:

Broken relationships
Death in the family
Loss of job
Move to new location
Loneliness/depression
Guilt/shame
Stress/fear
Well since in the diet culture, everything bad is blamed on fat, I think this one is a given. Sad? You’re too fat. Lonely? You’re too fat. So the solution to all your problems? Stop being fat.

4. Crisis Creation - They employ tactics designed to create or deepen confusion, fear, guilt or doubt. Convincing people that their health is in immediate danger, even when our best medical tests say otherwise, creates a feeling of impending crisis in a lot of fat people.

5. All The Answers - Provide simple answers to the confusion they, themselves, create. Support these answers with material produced or “approved” by the group. Seriously, I don’t even have to say anything for this one.

Programming Once you’ve signed up for six months, how do they keep you interested.

1. Intense Study - Focus is on group doctrine and writings. I don’t even want to know how much money I spend on diet books, food journals and point cards in my day.

2. Opposer Warnings - Recruiters are told that “Satan” will cause relatives and friend to say bad things about the group to try to “steal them away from God.” There’s no satan in weight loss groups, but I know I’ve heard all about saboteurs who will try to tempt you away from the path of righteoussness cuz they are so jealous of how hot ur gonna be!!!!

3. Guilt and Fear - Group dwells on members’ “sinful nature” (many use public confession). Guilt and fear arising from “failing God” are magnified to manipulate new member. Again, I don’t think I need to say anything.

Behind the cut, I’m putting the rest of the characteristics. See how many of them apply - it’s fun.

I also feel like I should say that this is all a bit tongue in cheek. I don’t think ,for instance, that Valerie Bertinelli is going to start making people poison themselves (except with crappy crappy food) or anything. But just like it’s interesting and eye-opening to look at how close some cult techniques can be to mainstream religious practices, it’s interesting to look at how some of the same types of thinking permeate the world of dieting.

huffing and puffing

A few weeks ago I took my sister and a few of her friends to the natural history museum. It was Sunday and crowded so we ended up having to park on the lowest level on the underground parking garage. Not really a big deal. So we park and I herd the tweens towards the elevators where I noticed a suspiciously large crowd of people waiting. Even though it was already lit up, I made sure to press the up arrow button just in case no one else had done it right. Then we waited…. Nothing. A newcomer pushed the button again - totally annoying, didn’t he know that I’d already done it? And still nothing. Oh well, not a big deal I figured and announced to the girls that we would be taking the stairs. There was some whining, but as I’m very bad at waiting and feel a bit ridiculous waiting for an elevator for twice as long as it would take me to get up the stairs, I ignored them.

I feel like I’m taking too long to get to the point.

Ends up that I had driven down further than I thought and instead of climbing a few flights of stairs, it was about five. Suck. By the time we got to the top I was doing that weird little gasping breath thingy that I do when I’m winded but trying to hide it (I’ve honestly tried to stop doing this, but it’s almost involuntary at this point - I literally don’t know how to breathe normally at times.) The girls were complaining, but not out of breath or red-faced. It took me the walk from the top of the stairs to the front desk (about a minute or so) to breathe normally again.

I was thinking about this today while reading the open thread on “Kung Fu Panda” at Shapely Prose. I was musing on how we as a society talk about fitness. How we define it and where we start our comparisons. Then I clicked on a link to an excellent post by Melissa at Shakespeare’s Sister. It’s a fabulous example of examining the subtle ways in which privilege can make even the best of allies completely oblivious to some of the subtleties of sizism. One line kind of brought me up short though:

If a film wants to be about fat, then it should make some effort to reflect the reality of being fat, the commonality of experience among fat people—which, btw, doesn’t include getting winded on stairs.

Now before anyone starts warming up their angry keyboard fingers, I TOTALLY UNDERSTAND WHAT MELISSA WAS SAYING. I do NOT think that she was putting down those fatties who do get winded going up stairs. I get the difference between rejecting stereotypes and putting down people who reflect some of those stereotypes.

It did needle me in a personal way though because I get frustrated at times. In many ways, I know I reflect the ‘good fatty’ stereotype. I’m vegan. I honestly love going to the gym and working out. All my medical numbers are good. I enjoy good health and I’m not above smooshing that all over fat-haters faces.

And yet, I get winded going up the stairs. I find myself taking twice as long to acheive the same fitness goals as people who are smaller than me - even when they are less active. I find myself hitting a lot of fitness plateaus and taking months and months to inch past them while past workout buddies seem to race from goal to goal.

Maybe part of the reason I’m not particularly bothered by watching a fat panda struggle up the stairs is that I see my experience in my fat body reflected in that.

And I wonder about the commonality of fat experience when my experience is so full of feeling winded and trying to hide it. Of lagging behind. Of not being able to catch up.

Part of me is philosophical. I’m 5′5″ and 250lbs. I need more oxygen to get up five flights of stairs. I’m naturally pretty strong and definitely can lift more weight than most women I know. But part of me still feels inadequate at times and longs to being able to run a 10 minute mile or jog up several flights of stairs without gasping.

I’m not sure this post has a point other than maybe me feeling like part of my new totally honest approach to FA has to include the ways I sometimes feel limited in my body. Maybe not limited…it might be more accurate to say that I think my instinct has been to always accentuate the ways in which I defy stereotypes, but now I also think I need to embrace the ways I embody them. Because so long as I don’t, they’ll have power to shame and frustrate me. And now, some of that power may lessen.

Also, it may help people to know they’re not alone and that there is nothing to feel bad about if they feel like they don’t ‘represent’ fat people well.

There was a girl I knew in college. We sort of kinda dated maybe a bit. Anyway, I introduced her to the concept of HAES and, in general, to the fat acceptance movement. She was very excited by the ideas and even decided to go to a meeting of a fat rights group on campus. When she showed up, she was told that there was some kind of mix up with the rooms so they would have to meet in another building. Up a flight of stairs, then outside up a hill, then up another flight of stairs. Everyone at the meeting was much smaller than her and, by her account, none of them seemed to struggle with the stairs or hill at all. But she did and by the time she was at the bottom of the last staircase, they were all seated and had begun. She went home.

It’s not a real fatties vs not-so-fatties or fit fatties vs sedentary fatties, but I wonder as I read the different reactions to this movie if we have less universal commonality and more separate sets of commonalities that sometimes overlap.

 

TRADITION!

It’s one of those buzzwords I’m hearing whenever people talk or write about nutrition these days. It often goes hand in hand with the condemnation of processed foods. Before those silly nutritionists came along, the store often goes, people knew about food: They had the wisdom of their culture and their diets were perfect and healthy. We have since lost touch with this knowledge (for the most part) and are paying the price with all our heart disease, diabetes and obesity (of course).

And really, I’m not going to completely shit all over this idea. But I think, like many decent ideas about nutrition, people become so convinced of the gospel truth of it that they lose all ability to think critically. I have seen some unbelievable blow-outs over raw cow’s milk, Okinawans, and most especially the role of saturated fat in heart disease. I don’t claim to be an expert on any of these things (although I will say that a lot of people pushing all sorts of food agendas got their degrees from Google University) but I do want to make a few quick points to keep in mind the next time you encounter some of the more common arguments for traditional diets.

Doubt, honesty and community

I became an atheist at the age of ten. It sounds precocious, but really it wasn’t anything more than realizing that the version of god I had learned about in church just didn’t match up with the world I lived in. Some of the beliefs were lovely, but the difference between a world inhabited by an all-powerful deity managed to look just like a world subject to random chance and I decided that it wasn’t for me.

As I got older and learned more about differing approaches to spirituality, I became interested in exploring various paths and ideas. Long story short, I ended up in Neo-Paganism (many would call this Wicca, but they are different.) And wow did I love it. The pageantry, the focus on the natural world, the celebration of sexuality. Sign me up!

I threw myself into paganism. I collected shelves full of books. I joined online forums (back in those days it was nearly impossible to find an IRL group that would accept a 14 year old even with parental permission.) I meditated and conducted solitary rituals. And I immersed myself fully in pagan theology.

And I never really believed any of it. I mean, I absolutely got something out of it -  a lot in fact, but I buried all of my doubts and disagreements. The ‘history’ of ancient paganism for which there was no real evidence, the abuse of complex concepts in physics in order to pretend there was a scientific basis for magic(k), and the existence of gods and goddesses which I still saw no reason to believe in.

Eventually, five years later, I left. Totally. I dropped out of the pagan student association at my university. I gave away or threw away every last book on paganism. I stopped going to festivals and scraped most of the candle wax off of all my possessions.

Question about dieting and fat activism

This isn’t some kind of set-up or anything. I’ve been thinking about this for a while, but haven’t come to any solid conclusion so I thought I’d ask you folks.

If the general consensus is that any attempt to lose fat (whether thru dieting, WLS or wish magic) is antithetical to fat acceptance, then does it follow that in order to be part of fat acceptance, one must also accept the premise that body fat is health-neutral?

My thoughts are kind of all over the map on this one. It’s tempting for me to dismiss the question since I don’t think diets work, but I also think that’s a bit of a cop-out. I don’t think there is a safe/effective way to turn fat people into thin people (which, due to fat-hatred has long been the goal of most fat dieters) but otherwise I’m not sure. And honestly I think the common response of “dieting to lose fat is bad, but practicing HAES is good” is a bit too simplistic especially given the possible problems that might actually be connected to excess fat. However, I also think people who say “well, I don’t want to be fat, but if you do, then that’s fine” are generally full of crap as well. We don’t live in a value-neutral society when it comes to fat so no decision about it can be made in a vacuum.

To be clear, this isn’t a prelude to a Why-I-Love-Dieting post, but these are the kind of questions I’ve long been asking myself. 

Also, I’m well aware that some people *don’t* think dieting is going against the spirit of fat acceptance. And I’m aware that no one person can decide what is and isn’t real fat acceptance so lets not have that debate here.

ETA: Do you think that the movement would be better served by having more separation of the movement for fat rights and the HAES ideals?

Where do we go…

Wow, I have a blog! Neato.

I’ve finally finished my last final and turned in my last project for the semester and now feel like I have the mental capacity to actually post. Well, to actually post what’s on my mind instead of random drivel or news stories that make me mad (which are both fine things to post, just not what’s been squatting in the ‘post’ part of my brain.)

So…. hmmm.

You see, I’ve planned this post out in my head dozens of times. I’ve collected links. I’ve typed excerpts. I’ve lain down the gauntlet and I’ve retreated into vagueness. In the end, it’s just easier to lay it all out, right?

I’ve been questioning my place in fat acceptance. I’ve been gazing at my navel (which is no easy feat as it’s generally tucked away in my belly folds) and trying to find my place, trying to decide if there is a place for me.

Why?

Oh, lots of reasons, really. I get stuck on the science a lot. The more I researched, the wider I cast my net  - looking, I should clarify, for more fat positive information - the more itchy I got. I don’t want to open this post up to that debate since, honestly, neither I nor most of my readers are qualified to do much more than rely on other researcher’s interpretations of their conclusions. But it was the first crack, I guess you could say. Finding out that a seemingly supportive quote was taken almost completely out of context, or forwarding an interpretation of a study to a stastitician acquaintance and getting a completely different take on the numbers…it bothered me. And as so often happens, when we allow doubt to creep over one area, all the other stuff we might have been repressing comes out.

Like the intersection of nutrition, health, fat and class. What does it mean for me to be a fat activist who believes that making healthy foods cheap and available is an important and worthy goal? Well, in a shallow sense it means nothing, lots of other FA people would agree with me..but..what’s healthy? Oh, that’s a bit of a touchy subject, I think. And if, as I said above, I have some doubts about some of the science - then what does that mean when taking into account that fat is more prevalent in poorer communities? What does it mean to be an advocate for fat people while trying to stay open about the best ways to advocate for increased access to health for all people?

Then there’s the food stuff. The vegan stuff. The nutrition and health stuff. I’ve always felt uncomfortable around it. Again, some of it goes back to science. A lot of it is about my trying to respect other’s opinions, histories, struggles with ED etc…  And well, without invoking the spirit of the drama llama on my blog, let’s just say there are some feelings out there on how to talk about these things.

It all seemed way too complicated. What had been part of my personal journey to self-acceptance and learning how to live joyously in my body was suddenly stressful. Should I post around my issues? That seemed dishonest. And really I wasn’t ashamed or anything. I just didn’t want to deal with the reaction I might get. Especially since I don’t really have a lot of concrete things to say. There was also some vanity at stake to be honest. To be relegated as one of those middling fat bloggers, you know, the kind who aren’t really committed or radical, who exist just to be the ‘gateway’ for true fat acceptance, no way. I wanna be cool too!

All of this went round in my head while I was busy with school and I could never come to a conclusion about where I was as a fat activist. Honestly, it seemed easiest to just let this blog go. It’s not like it was so important or so widely read or anything. And I could go back to where I’d been for years, hanging on the periphery of the FA movement. Problem solved.

But then something happened, I woke up every morning and was still a fat activist. I still found myself espousing HAES philosophy when talking to people. I still spouted facts about the utter failure that is dieting when friends asked what I thought about {insert popular diet here}. I still felt furious when a group of people who spend a huge amount of time detailing every little thing they eat, started talking about how sad it was when people convinced themselves that being fat was ok.

And I realized that I don’t want to stop being a fat activist. I don’t think there is any safe and/or truly effective way to make a fat person into a thin person. I think we need a helluva lot more studies done on the effect of improved nutrition and exercise on fat people’s health regardless of weight change. And I think our society needs to seriously let go of the moral judgement of fat. I want to be a part of that change too. I feel compelled to do it in my daily life.

So where does that put me? Who the fuck knows. But I think that my voice is needed in the FA movement. And so is the most radical FAist’s voice and so are all those people out there who find so much acceptance and love in the movement, but who have their own concerns and so stay silent. The only way a movement can move forward is through honest representation, not unity for the sake of appearance.

The downside is that we won’t always agree and that does suck. It sucks to think some people will read this and think “I could always tell she was someone who really believed in the ‘good fatty’ stuff.”* It sucks that people fight and act shitty towards each other or use the movement as a club to bully others (that, by the way, is totally general, but if it hasn’t happened, it will.) But a movement in total agreement isn’t really a movement at all.

So hi.

I’m attrice. I’m almost positive that diets are useless. I’m fairly certain about the benefits of good nutrition and exercise regardless of weight. I’m totally uncertain about the negative effects of ‘excess’ fat on the body. I think you should start your own blog, zine, podcast, cable access show or weekly megaphone shout fest and put your opinion out there. I think fat people are human and deserving of respect, equal treatment and sunshine-farting unicorns just like everyone else.

And I’m back.

 

* I feel certain that at least one person will think this since I’ve had several comments on my blog to that effect already.